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Given this, vocatives like that at Aj. In other words, unlike the example discussed in the previous paragraph, there is nothing acoustically non-canonical about the vocative here, and thus one wonders how D. As far as the big picture is concerned, my most serious reservation is that D. To be sure, D. But at various points I had the sense that to her pragmatics was everything even if she does not consciously subscribe to this opinion and that there was little room for other factors, such as prosody, metrics, semantics, or syntax.

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But I at least am not persuaded that it can account for all that she thinks it can, nor that some of these pragmatic patterns have not been grammaticalized. For there may well be an underlying syntactic configuration to Greek whether SOV or SVO , which is simply more prone to pragmatic reorganization than, say, English. Even D. A related problem is that D. She relies exclusively on one theory, namely that of Functional Grammar, which is a fairly insular and marginal school. Other approaches to pragmatics are theoretically richer and more nuanced for examples, see the works cited in footnotes two and four.

I have some worry that classicists will think that D.

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One over-arching question not discussed is what role prosody and specifically intonation played in signaling pragmatic status in Greek. In English not to mention a vast number of other languages , the informational status of a constituent can be indicated via prosody e. Obviously this is a very difficult issue to wrestle with when it comes to a corpus language, but nevertheless the question must be asked, as it has implications not only for the role that D.

In addition to intonation, one wonders how particles in their capacity to signal the information status of constituents interact with D. A few small gripes. Some of the terminology is unfortunate, especially 'Mobile. It essentially refers to prosodically independent words, i. The belief behind the term is that such words are relatively free as to where they can be positioned. There are, however, a good number of words that are prosodically independent but nevertheless are not so "mobile. Nothing is gained by the use of the term, and "constituent" or even "word" in the sense of prosodically independent word works just as well.

I at least am aware of no examples of clitics hosted by an item in a previous line, and if D.

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Earlier on in the work p. Moreover, whether clitics in Greek are syntactically or prosodically arranged is debatable; 8 what she means by "predominantly syntactic" is not explained, and would seem to contradict what we read on p. The title of the work is slightly misleading: the phrase "Greek tragic dialogue" sets up the reader to expect a more encompassing study: while all three tragedians are represented to an extent, greatest attention by far is paid to Sophocles.

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  • Lastly, the target audience. I was surprised and disappointed to find that examples were not quoted in both Greek and Roman scripts. The decision not to transliterate the Greek has severely limited D.

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    This is a topic that desperately needs the attention of both classicists and linguists. To conclude, this is a valuable book, but one not without its problems. It can be read with profit as there is a good deal that D. More, however, in the way of explanation was needed. Word-order variation is no doubt one of the most difficult problems in Greek, and my criticisms here should be taken as questions that remain to be answered: the nature of the topic is such that it will require ongoing consideration from both philologists and linguists.

    Her discussion of whether clauses have Topics even if there is no overt morphological Topic constituent needed to be more nuanced. For consideration of this and related theoretical questions, see e. Here I have in mind something like that found in T. Surprisingly there is no reference to the work of Gregory Ward on this or any other topic in D. He is one of the leading authorities on information structure and constituent order. See e. Birner and G. Her terminology here is unfortunate. The first problem is that "necessary enjambment" seems like it should refer to a phenomenon whereby a constituent must be enjambed.

    The second problem is the notion of "syntactical necessity. Had she simply used the term lexically-governed enjambment instead, she would have avoided both problems. Other points at which I wonder about her pragmatic judgments: 6. For discussion on prosody versus syntax in accounting for clitic positioning, see e. Halpern and A. Zwicky, edd. Sort order. Matt Weinberg rated it really liked it May 27, Erin Davis rated it it was amazing Jul 22, Kris rated it really liked it Jan 01, Sidney Kochman rated it it was amazing Oct 18, Sebastian rated it it was amazing Jul 05, Michael added it Feb 06, Jeremy added it Sep 30, John Pavlakis marked it as to-read Oct 16, Drew marked it as to-read Oct 17, Steven Chang marked it as to-read Nov 06, Galaxy marked it as to-read Oct 12, Rakel Jacobi marked it as to-read Jan 07, Arthur marked it as to-read May 14, There are no discussion topics on this book yet.

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    About Kenneth James Dover. Kenneth James Dover. A distinguished British Classical scholar and academic who was Chancellor of the University of St Andrews from until his retirement in December There is a longish article by Dejan Matic on word order in Xenophon. It takes my clause structure and builds it into a myriad scenarios depending on context to describe what kind of word order patterns show up in Xenophon. I guess it depends on what kind of descriptive preferences you have whether that is a satisfying approach.

    The CW review is a very short one, and does not give much more detail about my criticism than what I wrote originally. Generally, I prefer trees as more readable than other representations, e. You are commenting using your WordPress. You are commenting using your Google account. You are commenting using your Twitter account. You are commenting using your Facebook account. Notify me of new comments via email. Notify me of new posts via email.

    Word order in Classical Greek - Textkit Greek and Latin Forums

    This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed. Rate this:. Share this: Reddit Twitter Facebook Email. Like this: Like Loading I think some Classical Greek would do me some good. Amen to Carl Conrad on Herodotus. Her article on Papago word order in Language came out just as I was finishing my undergrad thesis, and reading it was a validating experience, shall we say, even if I did not know that word at the time:- Noun phrase in the Hellenistic period: Josephus does some amazing NPs to impress us in his purple passages e.

    Hello Prof.